C'mon county, save us from the trashing

This Madison madhouse thing will trash our town and scar our hills which I don't want to see at anytime. We do well in August anyway and our little town isn't ready to handle 40 to 60 thousand campers, drunks and rebels. The highway diet plan is being shoved down our throats too.

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  • Over reaction perhaps? 40-60,000 campers? Spank me if I'm wrong.

  • I drive and bike on Highway 50 every week. I look forward to narrower car lanes to slow traffic and at least a painted "barrier" to let motorists know that bikes are legal on this and all roads. I also have attended two city council meetings at which this topic was discussed and the only expert in the room (CDOT engineer) said that this approach will increase safety. I believe the engineer who studies traffic for a living more than those in the audience who use emotion and gut reaction rather than data to make decisions. Also, after all this discussion over many months, there was at least one council member who said "I don't understand" at least three times during the discussion. That was a little weird to me since I know this council member was present for the first lengthy presentation. In my opinion this has been a healthy discussion in which all sides have had the chance to be heard and our elected representatives have voted. That is how democracy works.

  • edited April 2015

    TO THE SALIDA CITIZEN COMMUNITY: Because we value constructive dialogue, please let us know if you'd like this letter removed. Our goal is to create a space that is different than other media outlets in the valley. We do not have a position on the event, and are not trying to shut down anyone's voice. Many people disagree on many issues, how we solve those those disagreements and work together to solve issues without bitching is what The Citizen is all about. Please advise.

  • So, a dissenting opinion is just "bitching". "Dissent is the greatest form of patriotism." - Ben Franklin

  • edited April 2015

    Unreal. The all infallible (CDOT engineer). Let's hope some bicycle self righteous parent, pulling a kid, doesn't get aced by a rubber-necking tourist because they thought they were in the right. It's not like this area is over-run by people with exceptional law-abiding driving or biking skills. Narrowing those lanes wont slow the majority of people down and everyone knows it. It will just put vehicles and bicycles into closer proximity to each other, which will increase the chance of something going wrong.

  • If anyone wants to see how well some painted stripes slow traffic....I suggest you go sit in Poncha Lumber's lot and watch traffic for a bit....

  • Narrower lanes slow me down. Maybe I am the exception to drivers around the world.

  • Perhaps you are the exception, from my experience there's very little that will slow down most of those that pass thru Salida in the summer en-route to another destination. Repainting the road to make it narrower, at great cost, will do little to alleviate this, as one pointed out, go sit in Poncha Lumber's parking lot. Where most traffic USED to travel around 45 MPH, taking a functional road layout and eliminating the functional part, did little more than cause folks to speed up.

    Another issue would be, that by driving below the rate of speed the majority of traffic is going, the invitation to pass on the right, speed up for yellow lights and drive even faster will be forefront in the minds of the drivers passing thru who are already exceeding the speed limit in an effort to avoid delays.

    The law of unintended consequences perhaps ? From what I read, the much heralded "Traffic Engineer" that designed that mess related that it would slow traffic. We have another engineer proclaiming that narrowing lanes thru Salida will do the same.

    I don't believe this to be the case, in my estimation, it will do little more than increase confrontation between the users of the road, make an already dangerous situation even more so by inviting bicyclists to add another variable to the equation.

    Not saying that there's not an issue to consider, just that the proposed solution seems ill conceived, given CDOT's overall track record, it will be poorly executed, and then we'll have a mess that likely will rival the one in Poncha. What will the end result be ? I'm betting that those who are in favor of the repainting will stick to their guns and proclaim it a success despite hard evidence to the contrary, and no entity will want to pony up money to change it back, then we'll be stuck with the dysfunctionality of it all.

    Hopefully it won't cost too many lives.

    Perhaps the real solution would be to leave things as they are, it's not really all that bad now. Doesn't cost anything, and leaves the door open to realistic ideas which might prove to present a workable course of action for the future.

  • I like the ruts in the road you find outside Canon City. Everyone slows down, even me. If these ruts were present on either end of our highway,, boom,,, cost effective solution.

  • edited April 2015

    Last year the city called for painters for 3 signs. Five minutes into the meeting Mr Varnum raises his hands as if parting the red sea and says, "I've decided, all three signs will be sculptures." The top tier cronies all cheer because they're metal sculptors. Thus, I was denied opportunity to even make a proposal along with the other painter there. The signs were installed illegally (no required notifications were made). At the same time, the three most prominent murals downtown have needed restoration or replacement for years. It seems our art leaders are too busy for such trivial things for they have a busy schedule of parties to plan.

  • I drive through Poncha on Hwy 50 on average a couple times a day at various times of day and what I'm seeing with the striped lane is cars staying out of that lane which was not the case before striping. The striping in Salida may or may not be effective but I tend to side with the people who's jobs are actually to figure this stuff out and have statistical data to back it up rather than those who just guess it won't work. If Poncha is the best negative example they can come up with it's a pretty weak argument as it's working there.

  • Huh >?

    Cars now staying out of the striped lane that wasn't there before the striping ?

    Am I missing something here ?

    Before the work that was done, it was a 2 lane highway, the "striped" lane you refer to used to be a lane of traffic. I get to Poncha at least once or twice a week, and I'm not seeing any improvement at all, seems to me anyway that all the work they did is in vain, they took what was a reasonably functional intersection, and removed the functional part. I'm not sure if it's the best example, however it is at least in the same geographical area..

    Now, as for siding with people whose jobs are to figure this stuff out, they are called Engineers, a group of folks who propose to solve issues by guessing. Granted, they are educated guesses, but guesses none the less. I have an old saying that's served me well over the years when dealing with Engineers. "Just because you can draw it on paper, does not mean that it can be built, and if it's able to be built, that it will work"

    9 times out of ten, this saying, is reflected in an end product. For a little more poetic example, remember the Mousetrap in Denver ? The engineer that designed that solution to all problems traffic, killed himself when what he had designed, and they built, didn't work. Not only didn't it work, it caused accidents, which killed people. The final straw was when a semi hauling torpedo's rolled.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mousetrap_(Denver)

    For what it's worth.. Engineers aren't always right.. ( I know, I are one..) In this case, I don't think anyone has come up with a believable solution that has a chance of succeeding. Folks forget, this is US Hwy 50, a major east / west highway. Not "F" street. For what it is, the current layout works. Just not bicycle friendly. But there are other options for bicyclists, each of them much less dangerous for all concerned. Use another route would be one option. Numerous alternate routes are available, most way more scenic, and safer than fighting thru traffic on Hwy 50.

    What is proposed seems hardwired to the premise of injecting slow moving bicycles into the flow of traffic on a major east / west highway at any cost is a good idea, and will slow traffic down.

    Huh>?

    Am I missing something here ?

    I suppose traffic will slow down for the accidents.. A

  • edited April 2015

    My example using Poncha stands.

    The stripes were added and lanes cut from 2 in each direction to one, in an attempt to slow traffic down through the town. It's not working as "they" intended. Sure......people aren't driving in the painted lanes any longer..... now they speed up and cut off slower moving traffic so they don't get stuck behind them in the single lane. No acceleration lanes were added to accommodate traffic entering from Poncha's side streets and now drivers are forced to wait longer to enter hwy 50 traffic safely, or accelerate faster to avoid collisions with moving traffic.

    Now I may not be the most educated person (not an engineer) but I listen to my common sense and it tells me to keep my bike away from frustrate drivers.

    How many proponents of this fallacy will step up and say "I pushed for this" when somebody on a bike gets killed out there? I know I'll be keeping names.

    One more question. If painting lines and narrowing lanes is such a grand idea, then why is the bike path on CR 120 being extended, when it would be cheaper to just paint those lines on hwy50?

  • Expanding on your thought, why the bike path at all ?

    Just narrow 120 down to two 8 foot lanes and stripe in a bicycle lane.. Paint, as you point out, is considerably less expensive than asphalt, and if it's the kick butt end all killer solution for Hwy 50, it should work out just dandy on CR 120.

    Right ?

    Ok, tongue in cheek, but it does bolster my assertion that there are many more desirable routes to take, if on a bicycle, than Hwy 50...

  • If you can't wear a seatbelt, stay off the highway.

  • Pristine pasture land, Vandaveer, to be covered with tens of thousands of cars and tens of thousands of people. The adjacent hills covered with thousands of the ticketless (not focused on erosion control). At the epicenter of the destruction is the Natural resource center. Ironic

  • I wonder if the fire danger rating will be high in August?

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